Rank System Consultation (2)

# Posted: 25 Oct 2007 18:09
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Quoting: bria

With the exception of Lee, it's become very, very rare that I see EC members around the chats.

Um.... really... because I've been in there everyday for the last two weeks. When did I get kicked out of the EC?

Seriously... to give credit... there's a few of us. We just aren't on at the same time or maybe we can't stay that long, but I try to stop in an hour a day at least. I just want people to realize that the EC is not that out of touch. We do know that there needs to be major changes and this has been discussed before... it's just been shot down. So we've kinda taken the liberty to come forward. We want change and the popularity of OTF back as much as the next member.

~ Amanda ~

buck_murray
Member

# Posted: 25 Oct 2007 19:06
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I agree with Polson! On the note about promotions. I have been in this community for 10 years, and I am sure like a few people, I see people that zip-zap up a bunch of HTML and make Captain, while the citizens of the community for a decade get a pat on the head, as Polson said. It should be more about the character of a person and the good behavior of the person, only a small added bonus if they are in a department, but that shouldn't be ALL.

And Yes, ditch the D'D and the Rotarren, since they opened I thought they wouldn't ever fill up with more than 10 people. Keep it minimal.

And NO on the expanded rank structure, I understand what some of the folks that brought that up are trying to do, but I know that me and Polson who have been here a decade would get bumped down to the bottom again and start all over with a super-sized stampede of cluster. NO!

Thanks for listening and God Bless.

darth_balco
Member

# Posted: 25 Oct 2007 21:36
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Quoting: kayana

In conjunction with that, I've been thinking about introducing special chat "ranks" as well that are based on no of hours chatted. The more hours you chat the more priviliges you unlock like say custom smileys, or a gift to put in your dossier. That way, for OTFers who simply want to chat, they don't feel left out either and can look forward to having new toys and games to play with. This will be done REGARDLESS of recs from seniors but simply on hours chatted so that no one feels left out.

I'm having a little trouble understanding how this would be more effective than to just give them the same chance at senior membership. I'm not trying to start up trouble, but from what I see of this is that it's still separates them from the members that are in department, at least that's how I see it. Or is it not separate? I'm confused.

Though I still think we should at least look into the prospects of being open theme as I see it's still gonna be OTF regardless of what theme it has because of the people that made it what it was. However, turning the Sci-Fi into a broad theme would work since it would encompass all sorts of shows that people like, as SG and others pointed out.

I would get rid of the affiliations, they seem outdated as well. And just have on chat room. Like keep the name Ten Forward but make it general Sci-Fi theme instead of a specific brand.

polson
Member

# Posted: 25 Oct 2007 22:17
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Here's a thought...what if we featured chat rooms? Like each month, the primary chat would be TF, CCC, MT or "the New room" (if one exists) and that chat room is the ONLY accessable chat room (save for special events like Trivia). No wait. That sounds stupid even to me now that I say it. Well it was a thought. You can ignore me.

darth_balco
Member

# Posted: 25 Oct 2007 23:12
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Quoting: polson

What if there was a "weird rank" drop down option (similar to the old armory, you slect a something and then you select a something else under that category)? You could select "default rank" and it would give you whatever matches your cl and affiliation, or you could select "Weird Rank" and beneath that is a drop down for like, a hundred different ranks? Know what I mean Vern? They would then be totally appropriate and we wouldn't have to worry about lamers putting in whatever they want. I totally volunteer to make up the ranks too!!! You know...assuming this isn't a stupid idea.

That has the potential for a lot of laughs, I would have three options though. Your custom rank (and if a lamer is being naughty, well just lay the smack down on him *l*), the Weird Rank,and the Random Rank. Like the Weird Rank only you have no control over it, you just pick it and enter the chat and see what kind of a weird funny rank you get.

bria
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 01:05
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I hear you all on rank privileges etc... the only thing is, yes, department work should be mostly for fun and all that. At the same time, though, it's nice to get something for it at the end of the day.

Personally, it makes no difference to me. I'm not really in a department, I didn't really want my last promotion, and I certainly don't want another. But I know that back in the day, receiving a promotion was a nice reward for the work I did put in.

But, and this is a big "but". I also remember feeling pretty disappointed when, for a few months (while I was eligible, obviously), I did a lot of work and nothing happened. I got praise, but no "formal" acknowledgment. And I thought about it, and I realised that simply because others were being rewarded - for less, I of course thought - in a "material" way, insofar as that's possible online, I felt cheated when I was given nothing but a "Well done, you did that really well". Which is kind of stupid, because when I think about it, someone's appreciation is much more important to me than custom avatar access or HTML. But the promotion system kind of cheapens praise, I guess.

I hasten to add that I no longer feel like that, but I can totally understand people who do. It's a horrible feeling to be passed over for promotion while someone who hardly did anything earns one. Not because you necessarily want the privileges, but because you want the recognition.

So if anyone can come up with a solution to that one, I'd be very interested in hearing it. Not more ranks or rewards, as most people seem to agree on, but something else. A way of saying "Well done", a way of making someone feel proud of what they do. Without having to go through a formalised process first.

sg8472
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 04:40
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In my opinion, abolish the ranks as they stand now. While it's nice to get the recognition deserved, in a way they motivate people for all the wrong reasons.

People are becoming too entwined in the departments that the chat is actually suffering. Firstly, I think we have far too many departments than are necessary, and because we have this segregation of genres, we've far too many teams within the departments. That was fine 2 years ago, even last year, but we've seen a large decline in visitors who stay until they're eligible to join a department. Nowadays, we don't have the resources to keep all of this going.

Downsize the ISA to a single cross-genre team; downsize Entertainment to Trivia (it's the only constant entertainment these days); and to be perfectly honest I don't even know what or if the other departments do anything.

Then I'd examine ranks. What's a 'Jedi Knight' or 'Captain' in relation to how OTF operates?

I'm a "Captain" and I think I was pretty much begining to phase myself out of the community when I was awarded that, due to exams and such. I was actually surprised I even got it. It sounds nice and all, but I've not done anything for OTF in months! And I still have this nice shiny title with all the nice shiny privileges.

Ranks should have privileges and responsibilities assigned to them, that's what a rank is, and when you no longer have the time to maintain your duties, you step down, revert to a non-specific title, and somebody else takes over.

For example, if you're in the ISA, you can have some rank which says so, ie."ISA Member" or "Security Member", or "Content Moderator" or something that clearly shows you do actually have the authority to enforce rules.

A QC is an administrator, for lack of a better term. There's your title, and it actually gives people an idea of your position is and what it entails.

Outside of these department based ranks, and there would be the ones most people would wear, which would be time-based titles based on how long you've been a member. Here's an idea, call new members "New Members" and people who've been around a while can be called "Members" and those who have been here for years and have been contributing all that time "Senior Members"

Give privileges based on these, but also on whether they are in a department, don't just give privileges to a CL7 because they're a CL7. Have the fun ones accessible after certain periods of time of membership, ie. Custom ranks and avatars. And have the operational privileges for people in operational roles.

Basically, use the ranks to motivate people to participate if that's what they want, but don't enforce them upon others. Other ranks and privileges can assigned with the "official" roles and positions.

Oh, and I still stick by getting rid of genres also. They're suffocating us! We might see an influx of new Star Trek members when the next movie comes out (coz JJ Abrams rawks my world!) but what about the year in between? Broaden the community, broaden to sci-fi & fantasy, and people who like Stargate but never watched ST or SW might start showing up. Or the Babylon 5 fans might appear. BSG has a solid fan base, and with it coming to an end after season 4 there'll be a lot of fans looking for like-minds to keep it alive a little longer.

Ditch the 5 chat-rooms and bring it to 1 or 2. Have we ever seen more than 2 rooms in use? And make it either a non-specific chat, where everyone can go, not just Trek fans, or have an alternating theme, or user-specific chat-tops.

bria
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 06:08
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Quoting: kayana

And yes I think appreciation is good. *nod nod* SMs and AMs too (I believe) have to fill out end of the month dept reports so it would be nice if we could include a section that says well done to people who've worked hard at OTF- if we put our thinking hats on I think we can think of ways to give back to the peeps who did all the work in the first place

Y'know, this is kind of what I was getting at. Do we need sections in reports, more fancy coding etc, in order to tell people thanks? Why not just dig out their email and just send them a few words all by yourself? Polson does it.

And I don't think there's any need to get rid of the ranks we have. Just remove some of the emphasis from them. If you can have as much as CL2 as you can with CL7, then yays. I do like the idea of unlocking special privileges for chatting a lot, if it's a system which doesn't need more voting and EC consultation and just gets on with it (no offence, I just think you guys have enough of that

)

Leading me to another thing to think about - is there any way of changing it so that if you don't say anything for ten minutes or whatever, you time out? That way, people can't just sit there and press receive. Which is kind of a silly thing to do anyway, but yes.

kayana
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 07:28
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And yes, I'm still of the opinion that we need to make ranks fun again and easily accessible not something for people to feel bitter about but I'm against abolishing them because that's part of the fun of OTF (or at least used to be). We just need to figure out a way to make it more fun while making sure that people's work isn't taken for granted either.

Removing ranks/roles/chats- this is going to need a comprehensive plan/overhaul so keep the feedback coming.

Thanks,

K

bria
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 09:10
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Quoting: kayana

I'm lost at a solution that makes sure people do remember to say thank you while not adding more work to departments.

Well, people shouldn't be made to say thank you anyway, they should either do it of their own accord or not at all. A forced thank-you means f-all. I think that's a big part of the problem. A lot of stuff is being taken for granted - and by that I do mean everyone, or nearly everyone. Not the EC, not the "regular" members, not department staff - everyone. And it's no one's fault because everyone tends to take things for granted. *l*

I think if everyone realised what everyone else was doing, and if we could forget the ranks and systems and bureaucratic stuff for a while, we'd all get along much better. And we'd all have time and interest to just hang out together and chat.

Think about it.

darth_malum
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 09:18
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Hmm....I've read the dialogue about adding a new room. It would seem logical, however, what brought members here long ago was how unique OTF was, and if you just make a general, open room, it may loose that unique quality that brought in members. If you're going to make a new room, look for a theme that is currently hot, and/or will spike in the future. The greatest rush of members I've seen since I've been here is the reason I came here: SW Ep. III. Minas Tirith is cool and all, and I love it, but the Lord of the Rings films are done. There's nothing to create a new popularity in the genre now. Star Wars films, as we know it, are done, for a very long time. There's still books being released, but nothing big enough to cause a major spike in members. As for ST, I'm not very knowledgable, but I don't think anything big in the ST genre has come out it a while, generating no new interest spikes. We need something that will have a huge interest spike in the near future, and will continually have these over time to generate new members. This is all just my speculation, of course.

polson
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 16:09
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Fats makes me feel dirty.

Um, I REALLY like Balco's RANDOM rank idea. Totally fun!

And I like the idea of gaining certain privileges on chat hours.

And I still think folks who recommend someone for a promo should zip them an email and tell them why. *nods at Bria for 'getting' it*

buck_murray
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 20:40
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Okay, there are a whole lot of good ideas being brought up... and to me, some very bad ideas. I have grown up in OTF and I care about it so much that I would hate to see a major change that would kill it, I don't want to see it go down in flames.

I want to suggest something, can we put up a survey that the members can log into and take? Like a 10-20 question survey on what they like, dislike, and what options would they rather have in the chat. Then you would get a LARGE decision on what the masses think.

Just a thought

majin_fett
Member

# Posted: 26 Oct 2007 22:45
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But Buck, without some major change, OTF will go down in flames. It's heading that way now.

And I think I'm the only person against a specific Stargate theme. I can see adding some avatars for it (I think we have some in the Senior's Playground, so it won't be hard to find them), but I don't think we should have one room devoted to it. Hell, I'm thinking that we don't need to have any of the rooms devoted to one theme. That's why I would like to cut down on the rooms to one or two. We all only stick to one room anyways. Just make it general sci-fi/fantasy. No, I am not saying make it just open themed. Keep the sci-fi/fantasy! That is part of the foundation of OTF.

I know that Lzr said that the spycam helps keep the chatroom safe. If we cut down to one or two rooms, why do we need a spycam? I can see having a spycam now since we have five rooms and it's easier to keep an eye on all five, but not if we only have one room. And yes, as always, keep the offices. It makes for good private department chatting, if it's needed (which I have needed it for Trivia meetings).

And yeah, I was bummed about the promos for the most part. 90% of the people who were promoted hadn't been to OTF in a few weeks. There are a few who I definitely felt deserved them (I already let one of you know in chat).

Please, do not take anything that I've said in this post as an attack on anyone. I'm just stating some things.

buck_murray
Member

# Posted: 27 Oct 2007 02:34
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Majin, I know it is heading into the flames right now, I was just saying I don't want to see a major change that WOULD kill it, like I suggested the survey to be given to everyone, that way if there is a major change, it is in the best interest of a majority of the people, so that way it wouldn't light as many fires.

I think the Spycam should remain as well, it is a definate plus for the community for several reasons, it is for securty from violators, and a good bonus/incentive for making rank.

And I do not agree with making the chat auto-refreshing, a small reason for that is people can keep track of where they are and who is talking to who without tracing back forever. And it is un-available to some computers, like I live on a navy ship and I cannot access chatrooms that have the auto-refreshing format, but like I have said, let's put that decision in the best interest of the majority.


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